I Like Roy Jones To Knock Out Manny Pacquiao

Published

13 years ago

April 2, 2012

Lee Wylie

PacquiaoMarquezIII Hogan 25 Last week, I talked about what I thought could happen if Roy Jones Jr and Floyd Mayweather Jr were ever close enough in weight and time to face off, which came about as a result of Jones' comments in a recent interview. Jones stated that if he and Floyd were the same size, Floyd would be an easy fight for him. While I don't think it would be an easy fight for prime Roy, I do agree that his style would have been well suited to that of Mayweather.

Which brings us to our next topic: prime Roy Jones versus Manny Pacquiao.

In case you've forgotten, Roy claimed that Pacquiao, as opposed to Mayweather, would have given him many problems to contend with – in particular, his southpaw stance and power. Before we go any further, I must stress one important point. By saying that Pacquiao would be a tougher fight for him than Mayweather, I don't think Jones is suggesting that Pacquiao is the better fighter of the two. I believe Roy, whose boxing brain was one of his greatest assets, is aware that more than anything, styles make fights. Roy's twelve rounds of experience with James Toney – a defensive shell based counterpuncher-would give a thinking fighter, like Jones, somewhat of a blueprint to work from in a fight with Floyd Mayweather. On the other hand, Roy Jones never faced a fighter that resembled the stylistic characteristics that Manny Pacquiao would provide.

In some ways, prime Jones and Pacquiao are a lot alike. Pacquiao's greatest attribute, like Jones' was, is his footwork. Lately, many observers have been mesmerised by Manny's handspeed; while clearly upper echelon, is somewhat misinterpreted. At his best, Pacquiao blindsides his opponents by feinting them into covering up, then using his tremendous mobility, he snakes around their guard and unleashes his trademark combinations. As a result of his opponents being discombobulated, Pacquiao's opponents all share the same notion, that because his hands are so fast, that they cannot see where his punches are coming from. The reality is, Pacquiao's feet are so fast, that his opponents don't see where his punches are coming from.

Both prime Jones and Pacquiao utilised a lot of foot movement. Both fighters could be defined as having an “in and out” style of boxing, and yet there are some stark contrasts. Pacquiao likes to bounce in and out of mid-range, using a lot of head movement, before attacking in an ultra aggressive manner. Jones on the other hand preferred to be out of range, backing up, before countering his opponent. Pacquiao, a rhythmic fighter, instigates the attack, whereas prime Jones, a fighter who fought using broken rhythm, instigated his opponents into attacking him.

As a result, I'd have to say that Jones would have the advantage in ring generalship. Pacquiao was forced into following Juan Manuel Marquez in all three of his fights. It's not hard to imagine Jones backing up, luring Manny onto him. In a twelve round fight, this could prove to be problematic of course. Pacquiao's punch output is normally in the higher range, whereas Jones' was often in the lower range. Over the distance, Pacquiao would be the busier fighter. However, unlike Juan Manuel Marquez, who allowed Manny to outwork him, Jones would have some trump cards to play.

During their last bout, Marquez did a good job of neutralising Manny's left hand attack. By stepping to his left, Marquez kept Manny off balance and kept out of the way of the left hand. The main problem Marquez encountered was he was so concerned with Manny's primary weapon – the left hand – that he did not produce enough offense of his own. This is the area in which prime Jones' style would prove better than that of Marquez'. When it came to defending, prime Jones, like Marquez, preferred to step out of range as opposed to blocking. However, Jones' combination of handspeed and power was light years ahead of Marquez. With Pacquiao following Jones, I can envision Pacquiao running into sharp, heavy counters all night long. The two best weapons against a southpaw? A straight right hand and a left hook. Jones' straight right hand was sublime. He would throw it with laser precision and move off before his opponent knew what was happening. I consider the left hook lead of Jones to be one of the best in boxing history. The power and speed he could generate from that shot with such little leverage was astounding. The lighter hitting Marquez was able to land his straight right and left hook often against Pacquiao. A faster-harder hitting Jones would be able to land for keeps.

More bad news for Manny is the fact that prime Jones would be able to match, or even surpass him in the footspeed department. Pacquiao is at his best against fighters who defend by blocking and using upper body movement. Jones was able to leap in and out of range within the blink of an eye. Because of his legs, supreme athleticism and subtle head movement, Jones had an uncanny ability of evading offense. In terms of hitting without being hit, Jones was one of the best I've ever seen. Pacquiao however, can be tagged. Sometimes, Pacquiao's answer to offense is more defense. Against a fast, powerful counterpunching attacker like Jones, Pacquiao could not afford to take clean shots.

Apart from his obvious handspeed, Jones was a master of timing and distance and every bit as good as Carlos Monzon during his prime. Jones had a way of making his opponent overcommit by standing there with his right hand out and taking small backward steps. Thinking Jones was within range, his opponents would attack, only to fall short and be countered. This technique gave Jones' opponents a false sense of distance – a Joe Louis dynamic. In his prime, this was Jones' bread and butter. Take a look at any fight involving Jones from '94 until 2003. You will see Jones stun opponents with his left hook and straight right hand using this very technique. Pacquiao, who often reaches and finds himself off balance, would be open for Jones' signature counters.

Back to Jones' statement.

I would have to disagree with Jones on this one. I think Manny's style equates to a Jones win..and not only a win, a knockout win. I believe Manny's style is tailor-made for Jones. Imagine if Marquez had the footspeed to get back in range after evading Pacquiao's assaults, and possessed the power to hurt Pacquiao after he countered. This is what Pacquiao would be up against facing a prime Roy Jones. Jones would be able to use Pacquiao's aggression against him by luring him onto his sharp, fast counters.

I'm a convinced that if Manny and Floyd ever decide to get in the ring with each other, Floyd will have the toughest night of his career, because of a conflict in styles. [For more on that, check out my Pacquiao could have the blueprint to defeat Mayweather article http://www.tss.ib.tv/news/articles-frontpage/14184-pacquaio-might-have-blueprint-to-beat-mayweather]. Manny's offense is best suited to opponents who utilize upper body movement, like Mayweather, as opposed to lateral movement like Jones. This does not mean however, that I consider Manny a better fighter than Mayweather, only a fighter who would hold a style advantage over his opponent.

During his prime, I would pick Jones over Mayweather – likely a decision win – and Jones over Pacquiao – likely by knockout.

A final word on Jones, Mayweather and Pacquiao.

Because of their popularity, and the fact that most observers regard them as the best today, Floyd Mayweather and Manny Pacquiao suffer from hyperbole. You will not only find them on top of current pound for pound lists, but in some cases, [and mind bogglingly so] at or near the top of all-time lists as well. The truth is, from a skill perspective, Mayweather and Pacquiao may not even be the best fighters of the last 20 years, let alone all time.

Nevermind Pernell Whitaker and Julio Cesar Chavez, Mark “Too Sharp” Johnson and Ricardo Lopez may have actually been better than both Mayweather and Pacquiao, but because they were competing during the Tyson era, they went relatively unnoticed outside of hardcore fans. Roy Jones, on the other hand, should rank higher because he was simply better than everyone else during his best years.

Don't get me wrong, Mayweather and Pacquiao are clearly upper tier fighters, who possess all-time talent. But I could make the case that we've seen their likes before. Sure, Mayweather's defense is phenomenal, but wasn't Wilfred Benitez' defense just as phenomenal? Yes, Mayweather's technical skills are to die for, but weren't prime Donald Curry's just as impressive? I agree, Manny's footwork and use of angles are exceptional, but i believe Orlando Canizales' footwork and use of angles were even better.

The point is, we had not seen anything like Roy Jones during his prime. He was incomparable, at least to other boxers.

Let's think back to when Roy Jones became the first middleweight champion since Bob Fitzsimmons to hold the heavyweight title. Many thought he was on his way to replacing Sugar Ray Robinson as boxing's greatest.

Now imagine, if someone had told you back then, that one day, Jones would be in danger of becoming UNDER-rated, you would have a hard time believing it, wouldn't you?. Sadly, that's the predicament now facing Jones. This is where boxing differs from other sports. Imagine if Roger Federer never won another game of tennis. He would still probably be considered the greatest of all time. Defeated at the end of the game, he can walk over to the centre line to shake his opponents hand and salute the applauding crowd. Boxing is not as forgiving. We have seen Jones lay unconscious in the centre of the ring. It is this visual that is so unforgiving for Roy. It did not matter that his first defeat did not come until he was 34-years old. The G.O.A.T should never be carried out of the ring, at least not in the mind of most.

We should remember Roy at his best, not his worst. He was boxing's version of Jamaican sprinter Usain Bolt – he turned wrong into right by using his supernatural athletic gifts. At his best, Jones was so much better than the opposition that he probably only lost a handful of rounds in over ten years of title bouts. There will be those who will point to the Eric Lucas' and the Glenn Kelly's of this world, but in response, I will point to Bernard Hopkins and James Toney, great fighters who were shut out like every other Roy Jones opponent during his prime.

Such was Jones' level of dominance in the late nineties, that he made us think to ourselves: Am I watching the best to ever do it? I've never thought that once when watching Floyd Mayweather or Manny Pacquiao.

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Lee Wylie

“Breadman” Edwards: An Unlikely Boxing Coach with a Panoramic View of the Sport

Published

9 hours ago

May 8, 2025

Arne K. Lang

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Stephen “Breadman” Edwards’ first fighter won a world title. That may be some sort of record.

It’s true. Edwards had never trained a fighter, amateur or pro, before taking on professional novice Julian “J Rock” Williams. On May 11, 2019, Williams wrested the IBF 154-pound world title from Jarrett Hurd. The bout, a lusty skirmish, was in Fairfax, Virginia, near Hurd’s hometown in Maryland, and the previously undefeated Hurd had the crowd in his corner.

In boxing, Stephen Edwards wears two hats. He has a growing reputation as a boxing coach, a hat he will wear on Saturday, May 31, at Mandalay Bay in Las Vegas when the two fighters that he currently trains, super middleweight Caleb Plant and middleweight Kyrone Davis, display their wares on a show that will air on Amazon Prime Video. Plant, who needs no introduction, figures to have little trouble with his foe in a match conceived as an appetizer to a showdown with Jermall Charlo. Davis, coming off his career-best win, an upset of previously undefeated Elijah Garcia, is in tough against fast-rising Cuban prospect Yoenli Hernandez, a former world amateur champion.

Edwards’ other hat is that of a journalist. His byline appears at “Boxing Scene” in a column where he answers questions from readers.

It’s an eclectic bag of questions that Breadman addresses, ranging from his thoughts on an upcoming fight to his thoughts on one of the legendary prizefighters of olden days. Boxing fans, more so than fans of any other sport, enjoy hashing over fantasy fights between great fighters of different eras. Breadman is very good at this, which isn’t to suggest that his opinions are gospel, merely that he always has something provocative to add to the discourse. Like all good historians, he recognizes that the best history is revisionist history.

“Fighters are constantly mislabled,” he says. “Everyone talks about Joe Louis’s right hand. But if you study him you see that his left hook is every bit as good as his right hand and it’s more sneaky in terms of shock value when it lands.”

Stephen “Breadman” Edwards was born and raised in Philadelphia. His father died when he was three. His maternal grandfather, a Korean War veteran, filled the void. The man was a big boxing fan and the two would watch the fights together on the family television.

Edwards’ nickname dates to his early teen years when he was one of the best basketball players in his neighborhood. The derivation is the 1975 movie “Cornbread, Earl and Me,” starring Laurence Fishburne in his big screen debut. Future NBA All-Star Jamaal Wilkes, fresh out of UCLA, plays Cornbread, a standout high school basketball player who is mistakenly murdered by the police.

Coming out of high school, Breadman had to choose between an academic scholarship at Temple or an athletic scholarship at nearby Lincoln University. He chose the former, intending to major in criminal justice, but didn’t stay in college long. What followed were a succession of jobs including a stint as a city bus driver. To stay fit, he took to working out at the James Shuler Memorial Gym where he sparred with some of the regulars, but he never boxed competitively.

Over the years, Philadelphia has harbored some great boxing coaches. Among those of recent vintage, the names George Benton, Bouie Fisher, Nazeem Richardson, and Bozy Ennis come quickly to mind. Breadman names Richardson and West Coast trainer Virgil Hunter as the men that have influenced him the most.

We are all a product of our times, so it’s no surprise that the best decade of boxing, in Breadman’s estimation, was the 1980s. This was the era of the “Four Kings” with Sugar Ray Leonard arguably standing tallest.

Breadman was a big fan of Leonard and of Leonard’s three-time rival Roberto Duran. “I once purchased a DVD that had all of Roberto Duran’s title defenses on it,” says Edwards. “This was a back before the days of YouTube.”

But Edwards’ interest in the sport goes back much deeper than the 1980s. He recently weighed in on the “Pittsburgh Windmill” Harry Greb whose legend has grown in recent years to the point that some have come to place him above Sugar Ray Robinson on the list of the greatest of all time.

“Greb was a great fighter with a terrific resume, of that there is no doubt,” says Breadman, “but there is no video of him and no one alive ever saw him fight, so where does this train of thought come from?”

Edwards notes that in Harry Greb’s heyday, he wasn’t talked about in the papers as the best pound-for-pound fighter in the sport. The boxing writers were partial to Benny Leonard who drew comparisons to the venerated Joe Gans.

Among active fighters, Breadman reserves his highest praise for Terence Crawford. “Body punching is a lost art,” he once wrote. “[Crawford] is a great body puncher who starts his knockouts with body punches, but those punches are so subtle they are not fully appreciated.”

If the opening line holds up, Crawford will enter the ring as the underdog when he opposes Canelo Alvarez in September. Crawford, who will enter the ring a few weeks shy of his 38^th birthday, is actually the older fighter, older than Canelo by almost three full years (it doesn’t seem that way since the Mexican redhead has been in the public eye so much longer), and will theoretically be rusty as 13 months will have elapsed since his most recent fight.

Breadman discounts those variables. “Terence is older,” he says, “but has less wear and tear and never looks rusty after a long layoff.” That Crawford will win he has no doubt, an opinion he tweaked after Canelo’s performance against William Scull: “Canelo’s legs are not the same. Bud may even stop him now.”

Edwards has been with Caleb Plant for Plant’s last three fights. Their first collaboration produced a Knockout of the Year candidate. With one ferocious left hook, Plant sent Anthony Dirrell to dreamland. What followed were a 12-round setback to David Benavidez and a ninth-round stoppage of Trevor McCumby.

Breadman keeps a hectic schedule. From Monday through Friday, he’s at the DLX Gym in Las Vegas coaching Caleb Plant and Kyrone Davis. On weekends, he’s back in Philadelphia, checking in on his investment properties and, of greater importance, watching his kids play sports. His 14-year-old daughter and 12-year-old son are standout all-around athletes.

On those long flights, he has plenty of time to turn on his laptop and stream old fights or perhaps work on his next article. That’s assuming he can stay awake.

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Arne’s Almanac: The Good, the Bad, and the (Mostly) Ugly; a Weekend Boxing Recap and More

Published

2 days ago

May 6, 2025

Arne K. Lang

Arne's-Almanac-The-Good-the-Bad-and-the-(mostly)-Ugly-A-Weeend-Boxing-Recap-and-More

Arne’s Almanac: The Good, the Bad, and the (Mostly) Ugly; a Weekend Boxing Recap and More

It’s old news now, but on back-to-back nights on the first weekend of May, there were three fights that finished in the top six snoozefests ever as measured by punch activity. That’s according to CompuBox which has been around for 40 years.

In Times Square, the boxing match between Devin Haney and Jose Carlos Ramirez had the fifth-fewest number of punches thrown, but the main event, Ryan Garcia vs. Rolly Romero, was even more of a snoozefest, landing in third place on this ignoble list.

Those standings would be revised the next night – knocked down a peg when Canelo Alvarez and William Scull combined to throw a historically low 445 punches in their match in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 152 by the victorious Canelo who at least pressed the action, unlike Scull (pictured) whose effort reminded this reporter of “Cat on a Hot Tin Roof” – no, not the movie starring Paul Newman, just the title.

CompuBox numbers, it says here, are best understood as approximations, but no amount of rejiggering can alter the fact that these three fights were stinkers. Making matters worse, these were pay-per-views. If one had bundled the two events, rather than buying each separately, one would have been out $90 bucks.

****

Thankfully, the Sunday card on ESPN from Las Vegas was redemptive. It was just what the sport needed at this moment – entertaining fights to expunge some of the bad odor. In the main go, Naoya Inoue showed why he trails only Shohei Ohtani as the most revered athlete in Japan.

Throughout history, the baby-faced assassin has been a boxing promoter’s dream. It’s no coincidence that down through the ages the most common nickname for a fighter – and by an overwhelming margin — is “Kid.”

And that partly explains Naoya Inoue’s charisma. The guy is 32 years old, but here in America he could pass for 17.

Joey Archer

Joey Archer, who passed away last week at age 87 in Rensselaer, New York, was one of the last links to an era of boxing identified with the nationally televised Friday Night Fights at Madison Square Garden.

Joey Archer

Archer made his debut as an MSG headliner on Feb. 4, 1961, and had 12 more fights at the iconic mid-Manhattan sock palace over the next six years. The final two were world title fights with defending middleweight champion Emile Griffith.

Archer etched his name in the history books in November of 1965 in Pittsburgh where he won a comfortable 10-round decision over Sugar Ray Robinson, sending the greatest fighter of all time into retirement. (At age 45, Robinson was then far past his peak.)

Born and raised in the Bronx, Joey Archer was a cutie; a clever counter-puncher recognized for his defense and ultimately for his granite chin. His style was embedded in his DNA and reinforced by his mentors.

Early in his career, Archer was domiciled in Houston where he was handled by veteran trainer Bill Gore who was then working with world lightweight champion Joe Brown. Gore would ride into the Hall of Fame on the coattails of his most famous fighter, “Will-o’-the Wisp” Willie Pep. If Joey Archer had any thoughts of becoming a banger, Bill Gore would have disabused him of that notion.

In all honesty, Archer’s style would have been box office poison if he had been black. It helped immensely that he was a native New Yorker of Irish stock, albeit the Irish angle didn’t have as much pull as it had several decades earlier. But that observation may not be fair to Archer who was bypassed twice for world title fights after upsetting Hurricane Carter and Dick Tiger.

When he finally caught up with Emile Griffith, the former hat maker wasn’t quite the fighter he had been a few years earlier but Griffith, a two-time Fighter of the Year by The Ring magazine and the BWAA and a future first ballot Hall of Famer, was still a hard nut to crack.

Archer went 30 rounds with Griffith, losing two relatively tight decisions and then, although not quite 30 years old, called it quits. He finished 45-4 with 8 KOs and was reportedly never knocked down, yet alone stopped, while answering the bell for 365 rounds. In retirement, he ran two popular taverns with his older brother Jimmy Archer, a former boxer who was Joey’s trainer and manager late in Joey’s career.

May he rest in peace.

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Bombs Away in Las Vegas where Inoue and Espinoza Scored Smashing Triumphs

Published

4 days ago

May 4, 2025

David A. Avila

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Japan’s Naoya “Monster” Inoue banged it out with Mexico’s Ramon Cardenas, survived an early knockdown and pounded out a stoppage win to retain the undisputed super bantamweight world championship on Sunday.

Japan and Mexico delivered for boxing fans again after American stars failed in back-to-back days.

“By watching tonight’s fight, everyone is well aware that I like to brawl,” Inoue said.

Inoue (30-0, 27 KOs), and Cardenas (26-2, 14 KOs) and his wicked left hook, showed the world and 8,474 fans at T-Mobile Arena in Las Vegas that prizefighting is about punching, not running.

After massive exposure for three days of fights that began in New York City, then moved to Riyadh, Saudi Arabia and then to Nevada, it was the casino capital of the world that delivered what most boxing fans appreciate- pure unadulterated action fights.

Monster Inoue immediately went to work as soon as the opening bell rang with a consistent attack on Cardenas, who very few people knew anything about.

One thing promised by Cardenas’ trainer Joel Diaz was that his fighter “can crack.”

Cardenas proved his trainer’s words truthful when he caught Inoue after a short violent exchange with a short left hook and down went the Japanese champion on his back. The crowd was shocked to its toes.

“I was very surprised,” said Inoue about getting dropped. ““In the first round, I felt I had good distance. It got loose in the second round. From then on, I made sure to not take that punch again.”

Inoue had no trouble getting up, but he did have trouble avoiding some of Cardenas massive blows delivered with evil intentions. Though Inoue did not go down again, a look of total astonishment blanketed his face.

A real fight was happening.

Cardenas, who resembles actor Andy Garcia, was never overly aggressive but kept that left hook of his cocked and ready to launch whenever he saw the moment. There were many moments against the hyper-aggressive Inoue.

Both fighters pack power and both looked to find the right moment. But after Inoue was knocked down by the left hook counter, he discovered a way to eliminate that weapon from Cardenas. Still, the Texas-based fighter had a strong right too.

In the sixth round Inoue opened up with one of his lightning combinations responsible for 10 consecutive knockout wins. Cardenas backed against the ropes and Inoue blasted away with blow after blow. Then suddenly, Cardenas turned Inoue around and had him on the ropes as the Mexican fighter unloaded nasty combinations to the body and head. Fans roared their approval.

“I dreamed about fighting in front of thousands of people in Las Vegas,” said Cardenas. “So, I came to give everything.”

Inoue looked a little surprised and had a slight Mona Lisa grin across his face. In the seventh round, the Japanese four-division world champion seemed ready to attack again full force and launched into the round guns blazing. Cardenas tried to catch Inoue again with counter left hooks but Inoue’s combos rained like deadly hail. Four consecutive rights by Inoue blasted Cardenas almost through the ropes. The referee Tom Taylor ruled it a knockdown. Cardenas beat the count and survived the round.

In the eighth round Inoue looked eager to attack and at the bell launched across the ring and unloaded more blows on Cardenas. A barrage of 14 unanswered blows forced the referee to stop the fight at 45 seconds of round eight for a technical knockout win.

“I knew he was tough,” said Inoue. “Boxing is not that easy.”

Espinoza Wins

WBO featherweight titlist Rafael Espinosa (27-0, 23 KOs) uppercut his way to a knockout win over Edward Vazquez (17-3, 4 KOs) in the seventh round.

“I wanted to fight a game fighter to show what I am capable,” said Espinoza.

Espinosa used the leverage of his six-foot, one-inch height to slice uppercuts under the guard of Vazquez. And when the tall Mexican from Guadalajara targeted the body, it was then that the Texas fighter began to wilt. But he never surrendered.

Though he connected against Espinoza in every round, he was not able to slow down the taller fighter and that allowed the Mexican fighter to unleash a 10-punch barrage including four consecutive uppercuts. The referee stopped the fight at 1:47 of the seventh round.

It was Espinoza’s third title defense.

Photo credit: Mikey Williams / Top Rank

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